[ ]   [ ]   [ ]                        [ ]      [ ]   [ ]
Cry Cry Cry — Cold Missouri Waters
Album: Cry Cry Cry
Avg rating:
6.9

Your rating:
Total ratings: 440









Released: 1998
Length: 4:27
Plays (last 30 days): 0
My name is Dodge but then you know that
It's written on the chart there at the foot end of the of the bed
They think I'm blind that I can't read it
I've read it every word and every word it says is death
So confession Is that the reason that you came

Get it off my chest before I check out of the game
Since you mention it well there's thirteen things I'll name
Thirteen crosses high above the cold Missouri waters
August 49 North Montana
The hottest day on record the forest tinder dry
Lightning strikes in the mountains
I was crew chief at the jump base
I prepared the boys to fly
Pick the drop zone C47 comes in low
Feel the tap upon your leg that tells you go
See the circle of the fire down below
Fifteen of us dropped above the cold Missouri waters
Gauged the fire I'd seen bigger
So I ordered them to side hill we'd fight it from below
We'd have our backs to the river
We'd have it licked by morning even if we took it slow
But the fire crowned jumped the valley just ahead
There was no way down headed for the ridge instead
Too big to fight it we'd have to fight that slope instead
Flames one step behind above the cold Missouri waters
Sky had turned red smoke was boiling
Two hundred yards to saftey
Death was fifty yards behind
I don't know why I just thought it
I struck a match to waist high grass running out of time
Tried to tell them step into this fire I've set
We can't make it this is the only chance you'll get
But they cursed me
Ran for the rocks above instead
I lay face down and prayed above the cold Missouri waters
Then when I rose like the phoenix
In that world reduced to ashes
There was none but two survived
I stayed that night and one day after
Carried bodies to the river
Wondering how I stayed alive
Thirteen stations of the cross to mark their fall
I've had my say I'll confess to nothing more
I'll join them now those that they left me long before
Thirteen crosses high above the cold Missouri waters
Comments (93)add comment
 coyotexxx2 wrote:

Such a surprise! This song is about the Man Gulch fire.  You can read the book called Young Men and Fire by Norman Maclean.  He also wrote A River Runs Through It.  Those crosses are just 20 miles from where I sit typing this comment.  



reminds me of Gordon Lightfoot's "Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald".  Hauntingly beautiful.  
I was in a grocery store last week and heard a tune that reminded me of this story, and it sent shivers down my spine and sadness in my heart...
Whoa...just read about the composer and the fire... And now in light of the Paradise CA fire from which RP gets it's name and the number of lives lost... 
It's so Edmund Fitzgerald-y. Oh wait.
Yes - Norman MacLean's Young Men and Fire - an excellent book about the tragic Mann Gulch fire, which pairs well with this beautiful song. 

expatlar wrote:
Some stories are better told in a short story or book.

 


Some stories are better told in a short story or book.
Such a surprise! This song is about the Man Gulch fire.  You can read the book called Young Men and Fire by Norman Maclean.  He also wrote A River Runs Through It.  Those crosses are just 20 miles from where I sit typing this comment.  
Umm me likes the story songs 
this makes me cry every time.
Awesome!  I hadn't heard this version before.

 
Love the angel backup singers...
This brought tears.  I know this fire.  Severe burning brings euphoria.  One man sat on a rock, in great peace, before he died.
I can't get the video of Keelaghan singing this to post ...


I never heard this Shindell song before,  great story teller, and then Gordon Lightfoot.  Story telling at its apex.  
Brr. Gets you right in the feels. {#Sorry}
Every time I hear this one on RP, I like it a little more.  It pairs so nicely with The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald.
Does anyone know if Dar ever sang this with James somewhere on the summer folk fest circuit?

Love both versions for what it's worth.  
 Muddyman3019 wrote:

I agree rather hear James Keelaghan's original version
 
Definitely.  Keelaghan's vocals are far superior. So much more pleasing to the ear and full of emotion. Puts you there in wildfire
 
I just finished reading Fire on the Mountain by John Maclean (Norman's son).  Quite a compelling read and sad story.  There are also a couple of good videos on YouTube about these fires. 
Regardless of who is singing this song needs to be played, especially now. It's a wonderful tribute to forest fire fighters.
Timely, the Forrest's are burning around here
 TerryS wrote:
Wish this were the Keelaghan original.

 
I agree rather hear James Keelaghan's original version
needs some cowbell
This song is not in my "wheelhouse", but I decided to listen when one of the lyrics caught my ear after I read an article on fire jumpers in the Atlantic Monthly (https://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/05/fire-on-the-mountain/361613/). I'm not familiar with the book referenced in other comments, but the AM article is a good read.... Pretty impressive song writing.
Moving lyrics.  Not wild about the guys voice, too much wavering. 
Wish this were the Keelaghan original.
An extraordinary book, "Young Men and Fire" has this as its subject. One of the most amazing books I've ever encountered. It's about life, loving life and a capricious universe that doesn't give a damn.
The true story behind this song was captured beautifully by Norman Maclean in Young Men and Fire. Mr. Maclean is probably most known for A River Runs Through It
This tickled my ears awake.  Nice stuff.
Such a good song, so much talent in this trio.
 Brianolstad wrote:
Such a great song. The original James Keelaghan is better though... I'm partial.

 
Ditto
Such a great song. The original James Keelaghan is better though... I'm partial.
Haunting true story.
What is this, the Hoe-dads "Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald".  Tedious.
 jhorton wrote:
Can't believe this isn't Richard Shindell?

 
Um, you should believe it, because it is.
Can't believe this isn't Richard Shindell?
I've seen James Keelaghan sing this song several times, this version is but a pallid imitation.
I was thinking about these folks the other day. Too cool!
Cry Cry Cry?   How come that guy gets to drive around with those two cool chicks? No wonder he looks so ... quietly happy.
Fantastic to hear this on the radio. Heard RS perform it live in Bloomfield, CT. Thanks!
This song is one of my favorites. The storytelling is powerful; I can imagine the scene, the tragedy, and the mixture of emotions Dodge might have felt. It makes me feel...
physicsgenius wrote:
Where's the part that explains why this song is so lame?
Clearly opinions run pretty positively on this song. Nice lyrics, beautiful harmonies and a true story origin seem to have plucked a chord with many of the folks that have heard this song. The fact that the chord you hear plucked sounds sour may have more to do with having a tin ear. By the way, it seems like your criticisms of late have more the qualities of a 6th grader whining than the physicsgenius of old. Where have you gone Joe Physicsgenius-O? Our nation turns its lonely tin ears to you. Whoo whoo who.
mgoldman wrote:
I hope I grow up to be as much of a genius as you....The plethora of negative comments get tiresome. The song is based on the book Young Men and Fire by Pulitzer Prize Winner Norman MacLean who wrote A River Runs Through It. Young Men and Fire won the National Book Critics Circle Award in 1992 Just so you know, on Aug. 5, 1949, 16 Forest Service smoke jumpers landed at a fire in remote Mann Gulch, Mont. Within an hour, 13 were dead or irrevocably burned, caught in a "blowup"--a rare explosion of wind and flame. The late Norman Maclean grew up in western Montana and worked for the Forest Service in his youth. He visited the site of the blowup; for the next quarter century, the tragedy haunted him. In 1976 he began a serious study of the fire, one that occupied the last 14 years of his life. He enlisted the aid of fire experts, survivors, friends in the Forest Service and reams of official documents. The result is an engrossing account of human fallibility and natural violence. The tragedy was a watershed in Forest Service training.
Where's the part that explains why this song is so lame?
A touching story/song....kinda pulled at my heart.
mgoldman wrote:
I hope I grow up to be as much of a genius as you....The plethora of negative comments get tiresome. The song is based on the book Young Men and Fire by Pulitzer Prize Winner Norman MacLean who wrote A River Runs Through It. Young Men and Fire won the National Book Critics Circle Award in 1992 Just so you know, on Aug. 5, 1949, 16 Forest Service smoke jumpers landed at a fire in remote Mann Gulch, Mont. Within an hour, 13 were dead or irrevocably burned, caught in a "blowup"--a rare explosion of wind and flame. The late Norman Maclean grew up in western Montana and worked for the Forest Service in his youth. He visited the site of the blowup; for the next quarter century, the tragedy haunted him. In 1976 he began a serious study of the fire, one that occupied the last 14 years of his life. He enlisted the aid of fire experts, survivors, friends in the Forest Service and reams of official documents. The result is an engrossing account of human fallibility and natural violence. The tragedy was a watershed in Forest Service training.
In addition, those "thirteen crosses high above/ the cold Missouri waters" are still there, accessible by boat and hike. Quite touching, from what I understand. I intend to visit them one summer soon, perhaps this next one.
I hope I grow up to be as much of a genius as you....The plethora of negative comments get tiresome. The song is based on the book Young Men and Fire by Pulitzer Prize Winner Norman MacLean who wrote A River Runs Through It. Young Men and Fire won the National Book Critics Circle Award in 1992 Just so you know, on Aug. 5, 1949, 16 Forest Service smoke jumpers landed at a fire in remote Mann Gulch, Mont. Within an hour, 13 were dead or irrevocably burned, caught in a "blowup"--a rare explosion of wind and flame. The late Norman Maclean grew up in western Montana and worked for the Forest Service in his youth. He visited the site of the blowup; for the next quarter century, the tragedy haunted him. In 1976 he began a serious study of the fire, one that occupied the last 14 years of his life. He enlisted the aid of fire experts, survivors, friends in the Forest Service and reams of official documents. The result is an engrossing account of human fallibility and natural violence. The tragedy was a watershed in Forest Service training. physicsgenius wrote:
I was going to excoriate this guy for basically just rhythmically reading a history book to music with little attempt made to make it an actual song, but then I saw the album cover. If this junk gets those babes in the car, more power to him.
CryCryCry made me cry. I heard this song long ago but didnt hear who did it, so lost it. And now here it is! Thanks Bill! Now i can cry my eyes out again.
pianocomposer wrote:
It doesn't sound particularly original or interesting to me either. I know there's a tradition in this type of "river" storytelling music, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. As for the girls, many guys (myself included) have used songwriting to get women. I wouldn't be surprised if he has these two under his spell. Musicians are notoriously bad at picking partners.
"River" storytelling? Here's an idea--listen to the lyrics before you dismiss them.
wow, this is really good. What does it tell you about Western society when Britney Spears is more popular than stuff like this?
physicsgenius wrote:
I was going to excoriate this guy for basically just rhythmically reading a history book to music with little attempt made to make it an actual song, but then I saw the album cover. If this junk gets those babes in the car, more power to him.
It doesn't sound particularly original or interesting to me either. I know there's a tradition in this type of "river" storytelling music, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. As for the girls, many guys (myself included) have used songwriting to get women. I wouldn't be surprised if he has these two under his spell. Musicians are notoriously bad at picking partners.
physicsgenius wrote:
I was going to excoriate this guy for basically just rhythmically reading a history book to music with little attempt made to make it an actual song, but then I saw the album cover. If this junk gets those babes in the car, more power to him.
I'm sure Nancy and Dar like being called "babes" By your typically simplistic viewpoint any song that tells a true story is dull. I guess that explains the mellinia's long popularity of singing story tellers. You sure told them.
Wow. An unabashed, undisguised folk tune on RP. I first heard this by James Keeleghan, who I think wrote it, but this cover is better. CryCryCry are, or were, consistently good. More of this please!
I Like it! Thought it was Peter Mayer before I checked the listing. If you like this try Peter Mayer - Midwest's most excellent folksinger/songwriter. RP needs some (more) Peter Mayer!
I was going to excoriate this guy for basically just rhythmically reading a history book to music with little attempt made to make it an actual song, but then I saw the album cover. If this junk gets those babes in the car, more power to him.
Rafter101 wrote:
First time I heard this song I thought "hmmm, what a wonderful, thoughtful song about a horrible tragedy." After the 30th time, I think, "What a horrible song..." Thanks for the (hurl) reference to the Edmund Fitzgerald...
I never quite understand comments like this, when the song in question was apparently last played a month ago, and then six weeks before that to the next most recent time. How seldom would a song have to be played in order not to be "overplayed"? Granted, it may have been played in between there and not commented upon. But I doubt it.
mikedill wrote:
Love Richard Shindell's voice. Recognized it immediately, but have never heard of Cry Cry Cry. Off to buy the disc. Sweet.
Richard Shindell, Dar Williams and Lucy Kaplansky form the trio. Too bad they're not all still together. Saw Richard and Lucy perform together a few years ago, then Dar came through 2 weeks afterward. It was kinda peculiar. Both excellent shows.
First time I heard this song I thought "hmmm, what a wonderful, thoughtful song about a horrible tragedy." After the 30th time, I think, "What a horrible song..." Thanks for the (hurl) reference to the Edmund Fitzgerald...
Very, very cool song. Not much out there about smokejumpers.
stevo_b wrote:
The Mann Gulch incident was used in one of my Grad School classes. The class it was used in was Leadership. Very strong points about the incident concern the ability to lead people and what can happen if your people lose faith in you. I wish I could remember the name of the book we used. I will try to find it, it is excellent reading.
The book is"Young Men and Fire." (click here)
Whoa! I love this. Had no idea it was in the library. See this for more of my take on it, a bit of the back story, and a reference to a great book on the Mann Gulch fire.
I used to work for the Forest Service and fought wildfires in Texas, Florida and Utah over a period of years. We were taught all about Mann Gulch and Storm King as cautionary tales to ingrain in us the need to be aware and careful. The first time I heard this song and realized what story it was telling it gave me chills.
Love Richard Shindell's voice. Recognized it immediately, but have never heard of Cry Cry Cry. Off to buy the disc. Sweet.
Originally Posted by Xpat: Hideous and steeped in bathos. Almost as bad as "Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald."
If you knew what bathos means, I suspect you might have put this differently.
The Mann Gulch incident was used in one of my Grad School classes. The class it was used in was Leadership. Very strong points about the incident concern the ability to lead people and what can happen if your people lose faith in you. I wish I could remember the name of the book we used. I will try to find it, it is excellent reading. Hope all is well. Stevo B
For anyone interested, Richard Shindell has a website www.richardshindell.com . If you liked this song you will like his other albums.
Originally Posted by Johray63: Just like this one BTW, though it will have a more significant meaning to Americans because of the subject, I think.
Well, I'm not american, but I sure like my songs with a bit of meaning in them... I spent an hour or so reading about the Mann Gulch tragedy, thanks to the links posted by Stuart below. Touching story, makes an already enjoyable song even more powerful.
Great Song!! I\'d like to hear more like this.
When you slow the verses of this song down, it\'s pretty similar to Miss You Nights by Sir Cilff (Whatever one may think of Cliff, a wonderful song). Just like this one BTW, though it will have a more significant meaning to Americans because of the subject, I think.
Have listened this song before, but circumstances allowed me to \"hear\" the song and it\'s lyrics this time around. Powerful message; quite a story.
A powerful song written by James Keelaghan (sp?, have his CD kicking around here somewhere, btw, play some of his stuff as well). Not just a paean to brave men, but a parable about the difficulty of creative leadership when in a crisis. And the fact that counterintuitive approaches (setting a fire to avoid one) often work. I listen to this song a great deal and contemplate. I\'ve have music by the three constituents of cry cry cry, but this one disc is greater than the sum of all of them.
What a beautiful song. Yes, it\'s difficult to write about a tragedy without descending into sensationalism. I think they did a good job, though. I hope there\'s always a place on RP for the beautiful downers like this one and Richard Thompson\'s \"Bee\'s Wing\". (Bill, how about some Chuck Brodsky while you\'re at it? \"Acre by Acre\" is wonderfully mournful as well.)
I bought this cd based on songs I heard for the first time here on RP. I love this song. It chills me. Thanks to the RPer who posted the pix below. Makes it all the more real and tragic.
Originally Posted by Xpat: Hideous and steeped in bathos. Almost as bad as "Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald."
This as a first person factual account of an event in which 13 young men died tragically. Since the story is told in a straightforward manner, I don't see your point. Perhaps you are disturbed by the event itself; If so, don't fight it; go with it.
My name is Dodge, but then you know that It's written on the chart there at the foot end of the of the bed They think I'm blind, that I can't read it I've read it every word and every word it says is death So, confession, is that the reason that you came? Get it off my chest before I check out of the game Since you mention it, well there's thirteen things I'll name Thirteen crosses high above the cold Missouri waters August, '49, North Montana The hottest day on record and the forest tinder dry Lightning strikes in the mountains I was crew chief at the jump base, I prepared the boys to fly Pick the drop zone, C-47 comes in low Feel the tap upon your leg that tells you go See the circle of the fire down below Fifteen of us dropped above the cold Missouri waters Gauged the fire, I'd seen bigger So I ordered them to side hill, we'd fight it from below We'd have our backs to the river We'd have it licked by morning even if we took it slow But the fire crowned, jumped the valley just ahead There was no way down, headed for the ridge instead Too big to fight it, we'd have to fight that slope instead Flames one step behind above the cold Missouri waters Sky had turned red, smoke was boiling Two hundred yards to safety, death was fifty yards behind I don't know why, I just thought it I struck a match to waist high grass, running out of time Tried to tell them step into this fire I've set We can't make it, this is the only chance you'll get But they cursed me, ran for the rocks above instead I lay face down and prayed above the cold Missouri waters Then when I rose like the phoenix In that world reduced to ashes, there was none but two survived I stayed that night and one day after Carried bodies to the river, wondering how I stayed alive Thirteen stations of the cross to mark their fall I've had my say, I'll confess to nothing more I'll join them now, those that they left me long before Thirteen crosses high above the cold Missouri waters
Thanks Bill
Never heard this before, good stuff. Good song about a very sad event that took place about 20 miles from where I sit. If you want to read an excerpt from the book look here:https://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/500616.html
I was really moved by this story so I did some further digging. Click here to read a description of what happened at Mann Gulch, Montana 1949. Here is a photo of the ridge where the 13 died and 3 survived.
I did a little research and this is actually a true story. It was the thirteenth fire of the season (1949) in Helena, Montana and thirteen smoke jumpers died - the first smoke jumper casualties in Montana history. The crew chief, Dodge, was one of three survivors. The song follows the true story almost exactly, which makes the song even more beautiful and moving to me.
I first heard this song in a friends car, on the way back from dinner. It moved me then (so much so, that I had to get the CD), and it still does. I have friends who work for the Department of Forestry, and I always say a silent prayer that they are safe.
A deeply moving song.
A terrific, haunting song, performed by a terrific ensemble. If you like this song, you must read Young Men and Fire, by Norman Maclean .